Sorry, but as far as I can tell this topic is totally in topic. 3 or 4 of the members are in a very deep discussion of the connections in mostly the earlier bomberman titles. Not a subject I'm very interested in myself, but it is easily the most active and deep discussion they have had in awhile from what I can gather skimming through it.

There's no need to break this down into multiple topics that would just make it more confusing for the participants.

So I wouldn't worry myself over it Ninja, especially since you don't seem to be much of a participant I'd just "come off it!".

In my opinion, you're barging in on them like that was quite rude.

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I agree with Regulus. As Zaphe said, our purpose here is to establish links between the games and plus, I find it replenishing to discuss about Bomberman. Thus, the topic will stay the way it is; sorry, Ninja!
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I have already stated my opinion in regards to the giant floating eyeball, that it is a subordinate of Bagular, whose domain and inteligence seemingly have no limits in the bomberverse, and it remains the same now. Now, about the Five Dastardly Bombers: I do think they could take over a planet or two before facing Bomberman so as to, perhaps, maintain resources and maintenance for their spaceship and therefore grow stronger. When they were defeated in SBM2, the remains of their bodies were sent to a scrapyard (a very bad thing! They could've reprogrammed them into good people, perhaps even recruit them in a Zero manner, but instead they just toss the poor things into trash...) and there stayed until Bagular decided to get them back. Although I have read somewhere that Bagular resurrected them because he needed help to take over those five stars, plot-wise it may be that they needed power for a new spaceship, and thus stole those chips. To know that for sure, however, I'd need to translate the japanese manual. I think I am wrong in this little theory, though.

[EDIT]: Hey, Bomberman Fantasy Race manual states that Pretty Bomber is rather sly for someone with such an innocent face, so you were right about she being on her own side, Duke. Sorry for doubting that! Also, I decided to stop calling the FDB that, beucase I previously thought "dastardly" had something to do with evil while the dictionaries say it is "cowardly" or perhaps "cowardly evil", and although the name sounds great that's not something I want to call my favorite characters, y'know? Thus, I may adopt "Five Bad Bombers" or maybe "Heinous Five Crowd" (a somewhat loose but very cool translation of the original name). Oh, that same manual also states she is the only female member of the "Evil Five" and that Bagular was the creator of the "Evil Bombermen" (and also that he was participating the race to gain funds for his evil plan to conquer the galaxy)... I think I prefer the other names, lol, but I may use those when I want to shorten the text.

Actually, now that we are on this subject, if you translated Bomberman GB 3, you know some japanese, right? So let us see if my translation is correct: the team name is "凶悪ボンバー５人衆" (something like "kyouaku bonbaa go jinshuu"), with the first kanji meaning "atrocious", "fiendish", "brutal" or "villanious" and the second one meaning "evil" or "wickedness", and while together they would mean exactly the same thing, I prefer to make it "heinous", despite this one having to be "gokuaku" exactly. But hey, "atrociously evil" is the same thing as "heinous", right? I think that's well-enough! Proceeding, the next four (which are actually kana, and not kanji) means "bomber", with leaves us with the last two, meaning "people" (although most kanji combinations containing this one are related to "man" in the sense of "person" and "true human being", and I wish it was "人造" because it would mean "man-made" and it would make a tremendous sense) and then "great number" or "masses". Thus, "crowd". Henceforth, the full name would be literally "Heinous Bomber Five Crowd", but that is a rough translation. If you'd let me change it a little, I would turn it into "Heinous Five Crowd", omitting the "bomber" because it doesn't sound that good to me and we already know they are bombers, hehe. Alternatively, the "Heinous Five Bombers", which makes more sense, but I personally find the first one a great (and better) name! What about you guys? Since my japanese isn't that refined (I can somewhat read, but I cannot write unless I already know the kanji or kana I need to beforehand, which is not really writing), that translation may be wrong, so please forgive me... But it is a great name, isn't it? It should also be noted that there is no kanji combination (in meaning) of "人" and "衆" (although if this last one changed a little tidbit, it would form "jinshu", which means "race"), and because of that I had to join both to make something understandable out of it. In reality, "crowd" can be "人だかり" or "人込み" (in this case, "crowd of people"), among many others. Japanese is beautiful, but sometimes it can be a pain in the ass, sheesh. I... Just realized "crowd" can be changed to "group", althout to me a group is not "masses" of people. Darn! Okay, then another of the possible translations is "Heinous Bomber Five Group". Do you mind if I stick with "crowd" (in a sense of small and not-well-meaning group, like "that crowd from down the lane", taking the example from KND), though? I like it better and "group" seems far too normal for such an amazing team of evil bombers, as well as my favorites ones, hehe. Thanks!

Last but not least, it seems Duke wasn't the only one to theorize Honey was in fact Pretty Bomber: some japanese players even made sketches comparing their appearances and some theorized that when Pretty Bomber came to Earth (or Planet Bomber, whatever, I prefer calling it Earth) she became a popstar with the alias of Honey. I do know that is not the case since both appear together in the same game, and Honey is merely a mascot, her name coming from "Honey Bee" and a bee being on Hudson's logo, but it's still interesting to see what people over there think about this matter, uh? It is not entirely unlikely that it may be an easter egg of sorts. However, I doubt it, and prefer to think of them as separate characters, since Honey and Kotetsu have a story together as mascots and were made to look exact opposite (he is a man, a samurai, the symbol of eastern culture, and she is a cowgirl, the symbol of western culture from Japan's point of view, at least).

To think this was such a small post before the edit, phew! Excuse me if I said something stupid, 'kay?

I don't think they threw the Five Bad Bombers in the trash, I think that was the wreckage of their ship floating in space, or at least, that's what I gathered.

I knew what "dastardly" meant, that why I refuse to say "Five Dastardly Bombers". I didn't want to bring the issue up, though, since you seemed to like the name. What about the Five Heinous Bombers? That seems like it would make the most sense via translation, since other Bomber groups are named in a similar fashion. Me, though, I'm going to have trouble changing from the Five Bad Bombers. I really don't think it matters what they are called as long as the adjective isn't as degrading as "dastardly."

And yeah, Honey is different from Pretty Bomber, I think somebody mentioned they both appeared in the same game once so unless the doppleganger effect is true....

Hm, I thought it was a scrapyard because Earth is seen in the intro (and also because I saw that somewhere, lol), but you may be right, much like old satellites float around our planet. Oh, also, "Five Heinous Bombers" makes sense, but wasn't this pattern brought by the official translations rather than coming directly from Japan?

It probably was brought about by translations. I wish they'd try to keep Japanese media translations as close to the originals, unfortunately, there's a lot of guessing and (sometimes intentional) slaughtering.  

True. I was searching around and found out that the group that appears both in ending and Battle Mode of SBM3, as well as in Panic Bomber W, is called the "World Bombers" ("ZA WARUDO BONBAAZU", lol!).

[EDIT]: I've found out the name of SBM3's final mecha. It's "Gattaida" (ガッタイダー), meaning "union", "fusion", or "to unite". I also discovered that "Carat Diamond" and "Dr. Mook" are perfect, literal translations of their original names.

In regards to the original name of the Five Bomber Kings, it is loosely the "Four Heavenly Bombers" (ボンバー四天王), but with a much deeper meaning.Those last three are kanji for "the Four Devas", or more accurately, "Shitennou". Tenku Senki Shurato, anyone? It comes from Hindu mithology. Deva, however, is a collective title, and individually they would be called "Kings". Thus, we have here the origin of the "Five Bomber Kings". Great Bomber was the leader (much like Vishnu in Shurato) and thus was not part of the group (he does appear separated from the others in the intro), but since that could not be understood by american public, they changed it to "Five". In any case, they are the "Bomber Shitennou", and now that I look at them, they in fact seem based on Hindu mithology (in appearance, I mean)! I'll check out SBM5's villains later on.

This is what I think as well.


Actually, considering that each of their sections went boom at a separate time, and that I don't imagine Bomberman was carrying around their corpses, I always thought they had just fallen into that scrapyard. Admittedly, it seems too convenient that they all fell in that place but hey, it served SBMan3's plot, and this is videogames we're talking about.
However, I guess it's also possible that they fell in various places and were individually dumped there.


Maybe only Bagular has that sort of technology?

Thanks for the Fantasy Race tidbits  


Sorry but no, I wasn't the one doing the translating, David-MakoKnight was.

I can't really say crowd makes sense to me (isn't a crowd just an occasional gathering of people?) but hey, if are want to rename them, you can call them anything. Just don't be surprised if people have trouble understanding who you're talking about.

So even in Japanthere's speculation concerning those two? Makes me wonder if Pretty Bomber has ever been labeled "Hudson's honey" by any official sources.

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Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

I see. Since Duke just posted (in case you didn't see, please read the previous post since I edited it, hehe), I'll add a little something I forgot to put in the other one: it seems the Bomber Shitennou are implanted with "Bagular chips" so as not to rebel. I think that may be a hint as to the Heinous Five attack on Phantarion, perhaps proving that it was indeed not related to Bagular in any way. Just adding to that, though!

And, I don't think so. I'll try to check the now-defunct Honey's website to be sure.

Wow Shiro, you're really good at this.

Super Bomberman 3-5 were never released in the US, and I wasn't aware that 4-5 were even translated to anything other than Japanese... were they released in other parts of the Americas?

That's interesting about those Super Bomberman 4 villains, although I always understood them to be known as "The Four Bomber Kings and Great Bomber" instead of "The Five Bomber Kings", I can't remember where I heard it though.


That's interesting, there was a group of Bombermen in Jetters named by that same name. I know you don't want to talk about Jetters but I have to point this out!  


I never thought of them actually falling somewhere, I always guessed that they just floated in space. I guess, though, that Shiro falls down to the planet again, so it's possible that the FBB as well would have fallen down if they were that far away when Shiro fell.

Ever wonder why video game characters flicker away when they die? I know it's just a special effect, but.... anyway.

EDIT:

Woah, that's a very important development.

That sounds closer to Gutzinga (pronounced Gatz) than faito... so I win  


Ah, more of these? And here I thought Megaman Zero was being original...


How so?
I can kinda trace parallels between Harpuia and Jet Bomber as well as Fafnir and Bazooka Bomber. Just for the heck of it.


Is that from the manual? And I take it, you are speculating that it may be extended to the FBB.


They were not.


...and those too yes.


Because corpses aren't suitable content for children to be exposed to, apparently.

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Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

Indeed. The information on the Bagular chips are actually from an excerpt of the manual, not the manual itself since don't have it (but long for it). I'm also not extending that to the Heinous Five, as I said "so as not to rebel", maybe adding a "again", hehe. I mean, the chips may have been made because of them, but them themselves using it is something I find hard seeing what happened in Bomberman Tournament. Zaphe, you are right about they being "Great Bomber and the Four Bomber Kings". Their american name is stated in the Bomberman Party Edition manual. I had seen "Five Bomber Kings" in Wikipedia, hehe, sorry!

Now to Super Bomberman 5! The villains are called the "Star Bomberman" (ボンバー星). There is nothing much special about them, but the one that freed them (whose name I don't know, but it seems to be "Emperor Terrorin" according, once again, to Wikipedia) may have gotten his time-bending technology from Bagular. I saw this last thing in the japanese wiki, however, so it's not confirmed. As to the appearance of the Bomber Shitennou, it's their color scheme that looked similar to me, Lady Bomber's being the most prominent of them since she has marks and such on her suit. I can't really say anything else, but it is the same color scheme was the same as the five main characters of Tenku Senki Shurato. I also see your point in regards to Harpuia and Fafnir.

Aand... I'll stick with my "FIGHT!" since I've been hearing "Gattai" for long, and it was displayed more obviously in one of my favorite animes, Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann. Truthfully, I don't hear they say "gattai" not even in a million years, lol. But then again, there are many voices overlapped, so I could be wrong. I'd need a sound file to know exactly what they say...

[EDIT]: Now for something more interesting: Brain Bomber. The barrier he raises before throwing his jelly bombs, don't they seem like the one Bagular raises, albeit green and smaller? I think that pretty much proves he stole the technology from his previous master.

Don't you mean "whatver happened before"? We don't know whether the left Bagular or or it was hiom who sent them off to fend for themselves after repeated failures to defeat Shirobom.


Uh... are you sure? According to my sources, they are the "Brutal Bombers".


Terrorin (Temporin? Nah...) is a freaking living clock, so I don't think he needed Bagular's help for that. Besides, his powers in that sense seem to exceed Bagular's by a long shot.


Interesting! I'll have to look into that  


*Slaps forehead* I think you just gave me a brain aneurysm...

, and it was displayed more obviously in one of my favorite animes, Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann. Truthfully, I don't hear they say "gattai" not even in a million years, lol. But then again, there are many voices overlapped, so I could be wrong. I'd need a sound file to know exactly what they say...


Or that before parting ways he had been upgraded by him to have that. But then again, Kurobom also had that barrier in the first PCE game (and obsiously so does KingBomber in the arcade game by Irem)

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Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

Actually, I'm not really sure. In the place I was lookin', that was the only kanji refering to bombers. In the rest of the phrase, they were merely called "thugs". Also, you are right about Bagular not being involved, that was a mistranslation on my part. The page merely said the time-manipulation was similar (and it was, really). Also², Terrorin's full name is said to be "Space-Time Emperor Terrorin" (時空帝王), the "Terrorin" part being very hard to translate since it comes from "terrorism" (not "time") and an "n" added. I saw no sign of Brutal Bombers, but then again, it is not a manual. They may have simply missed something.

I don't think Bagular would send his bombers off to fend for themselves if he himself was defeated alongside them. He did tried to get Pretty Bomber back, too! Plus, if he was to do that, he would have not upgraded Brain Bomber. Even if Kurobon had this ability, it is more likely that Brain Bomber based it (or stole it) from Bagular, since, well, it's his creator.

Haha, I guess that could be the original reason, but I think that more recent 2D games that use this effect probably keep it for the classic effect.

Emperor Terrorin came from another dimension, I'm fairly certain, therefore he already had those powers. The Brutal or Star or whatever Bombers are criminals who were locked up for various reasons, such as mass destruction or robbery. The manual has been translated here, a looong time ago, and it calls them the Fiendish Bombers. Originally it had scans of the comic inside, and another with the text replaced, but now it only has a text script.


LOL!


Is this slip-up my fault?  

Yes, you're right. I already corrected myself, hehe. But you have to admit the time-travel Bagular uses is indeed very similar to the one Emperor Terrorin has! Maybe Bagular got it from him, lol.

Oh, and it seems my translation on Terrorin's name was different than his. I think mine is more accurate, though, since the kanji has a definite meaning of "space-time". Or maybe the kanji on the manual was different, who knows? Hm, by the time that manual was made perhaps there was no english reference to "Louie", uh? Maybe that's why Wikipedia is so full of "Roo-ey" and I have to keep editing some articles.

Corrected yourself on what?

I just noticed something... the story description says that Emperor Terrorin is "self-styled." So, does this mean that he's not really an Emperor? Maybe he's just some random guy like Bagular who got crazy powers and decided to wreak havoc. I had always been under the impression that he was some kind of tyrant over his own dimension, but this seems to suggest otherwise....

I think it's kind of funny, though, that it says that the prison they're in is the most heavily guarded.... it just seemed like they were prison cells floating in space.  

Hahaha, and they were! Sorry, I corrected myself in regards to Terrorin getting his space-time bending powers from Bagular, a few posts back.

It is said on that manual that he created Terrorin Dimension and named himself Emperor of it. What an ego!

So is Terrorin World a new dimension, the dimension he came from, a dimension within Bomberman's dimension, or a theme park?

SB 1-3 are pretty straightforward, while the last two are still kinda fuzzy, at least for me.

Technicaly, he only captured her for use as Shirobom bait.


Maybe he was already upgraded in 3, but we don't get to see it because he figths with his "mech" right away.


What are you talking about?


I would say the latter, but more accurately, a dimension made of moments/places isolated from Bomberman's universe/past.

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Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

That's true, I never thought about it that way. We don't know what all Bagular added to the FBB when he revived them. Although, before SB3, it seems like they couldn't do the thing where they turn into little white bolts and fly off, so I've always thought that Bagular enhanced them with that in SB3.


It's "bon", not "bom", perhaps you've gotten some things jumbled up?


Probably. But where does Terrorin's realm come from? His own dimension? It seems like that disturbing mechanical place with all the weird gear things is where he is located (the boss areas).