Since this turned into a Bomberman series and storyline discussion, the title is now more fitting. I must remember to save all of this information later, as it is very precious for a fanboy like myself, hehe!

[NOTE]: This topic has heavy spoilers. If you don't want to be spoiled, stop now. Close the window. Go watch Jetters or something.

Wow, I've had this same discussion about Bomberman '94 as well.... and how an early design of Bagular seems to be the villain.

As far as I can tell, Bomberman II on NES was released after the first Bomberman on PCE and before 93. In turn, 93 was released before Super Bomberman, after which came 94 and then the rest of the SNES games. It's not really clear when exactly Neo Bomberman came along. I would say some time after Super Bomberman 5 (and possibly Bomberman 64).


Or rather the other way arouns since SBMan3 came after 94. Also in 94 the stage of the adventure is Planet Bomber (whose "five areas" are thrown in chaos by the theft of those control chips) whereas in SBMan3 it's a bunch of other planets that need rescuing (and the threat in the end is different too, that in 94 being so much more cool IMO)


What's that?


That would be because (AFAIK) Bomberman 64 (2001) is a Nintendo 64 port of Bomberman Land with some games added to the mix.


Me being one of those who didn't. So I could well be wrong in my previous statement. But I am quite certain Bomberman Land (on PS1) was the first game to come up with the chibi style.

_________________
Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

But that is what I meant in the first place, the games that inspired the SNES collection, not that were inspired by them. I think the plots are similar in the way that something is torn apart (either control chips or relics) by five unknown forces (the Five Dastardly Bombers or the... uh, five bizarre monsters-thingies) sent by a master (probably Bagular in both cases, and although I could be wrong, I prefer to think of it that way) and it's up for Bomberman to defeat them and save the world/galaxy. The areas are also similar (except, as I said before, for the haunted mansion).

[EDIT]: You do have a nice intuition, y'know? Neo Bomberman was indeed released in 1997, one year after Super Bomberman 4 and about the same time as Super Bomberman 5. So it was really made with 4's elements, not the other way around as I said. Sorry, sorry!

About SFF and Yabause, they are Sega Saturn emulators. SSF needs something called "SS2", which comes or not with the computer's processor. Mine is the second case, so I can only play using Yabause, another very good, but currently not enough developed, emulator. I'd get a Sega Saturn myself, but they're kinda expensive here in Brazil (about $320,00) so it's a no-deal, really.

Concluding, in regards to Bomberman 64, you are right but wrong at the same time. I dug around a little and found that the PSX's Bomberman Land was indeed released before (2000), but, as far as I know, Bomberman 64 seems to be a conventional bomb'em-up with additional modes. Buuuut, since I don't understand japanese and therefore can't play through all modes, I may be wrong.

I concur. Just wanted to clarify/expand on that  


No problem. I just wish I knew how to work out all the games Bagular has been in after SBMan 4 and up to Bomberman Hero (I suppose it is in Bomberman World that he dies, though I don't think he looks any more dead in it than in Neo... and then there's Bomberman Fight which I know very little about).


Ah I see, I'll have to look into that when I have the time, thanks  


Oh, am I mistaken indeed? Let us see...
This is Bomberman Land and this is park mode in Bomberman 64.
I don't know if it's the same game, but I can tell you BMan64 is not just a conventional bomb'em-up :P
(Though like I said, it has other modes as well)

_________________
Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

Oh, I see. It's because the first mode is the bomb 'em-up (the first option, I mean) and I usually take that as the main mode. Plus, I can't really play the other modes because there are lots of weird options in japanese which I don't understand at all. I did say it has additional modes, but it seems you are right after all, so, sorry again! Hm, that kinda reminds of Bomberman Kart DX's RPG mode, too, although dungeon crawling is so much fun. About Neo Bomberman, I really don't know where it is placed in the storyline, because Bagular seems to want to recover Pretty Bomber, who has somewhy joined the good guys (which is canon along the newer games). Pretty Bomber was destroyed in Super Bomberman 2 and later recovered and fixed in Super Bomberman 3 (in which she also takes part of the Battle Mode, although her pixel art doesn't appear at the end). This means Neo Bomberman could take place either after or during 3, BUT, as you pointed out, Bagular's body is disposed, with only his brain making out of the spaceship to return in Super Bomberman 4, so that first option is a no-go.

Maybe he rebuit his body? He seems smart, anyway, if he made so many robots (including a pretty, human-like one).

Then, as you also said, there's Saturn Bomberman FIGHT!, a game that I find somewhat interesting (although Miss Honey looks like fat), because one of the characters is a non-evil Golem Bomber (he is shown to like animais and to be living in a forest of sorts). With this, my best bet is that two or more of the Five Dastardly Bombers survived and continued with their lives. Oh, discussing theories about Bomberman is SO replenishing!

Also something else, unrelated: remember Super Bomberman 3 password screen, in which if you enter a correct password Pretty Bomber is shown without a helmet? Considering she is the only Dastardly Bomber that has no visible robotic parts, it is highly likely that she was built with a human body (and I prefer to think of it that way), although it can be a mere easter egg of Haruka Sawaguchi, the actress and singer that used to represent Pretty Bomber in some promotional videos, music clips and commercials. In any case, my (uber-fanatic) fandom gets stronger and stronger every minute!

Pretty Bomber seems to be on her own side in Neo Bomberman. I mean, by the end of it, when (after being rescued from Bagular) she drops a bomb between Shiro and Kuro before taking off.
...and then in Story/Tournament she's back on the Dastardly team (though it should be noted that Bagular is not in that game and leadership has gone from Plasma to Brain).
Figures.


Yeah, I'd say that's the only possible explanation.


Oh, that is interesting. And is Bagular in that game?


Now this easter egg idea is a theory I had not heard before! Do you have any photos of her?
Anyway, according to the manual of Super Bomberman 2, the Dastardly Bombers are all cyborgs. I dunno how much I trust the guys who translated it though. If I had scans of the Japanese plot, I could maybe get a friend to double check it.

_________________
Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

I long for scans of the manuals of Super Bomberman 2 and 3, even if they are in english or japanese, I wish someone made them... Cahem. You are right about Neo Bomberman, but at the start she is alongside Bomberman and his friends, and after tossing the bomb she is seen flying in the sunset with Shiro and Kuro following her. It's such a pity she isn't available in the Battle Mode. In regards to Bagular being in Saturn Bomberman FIGHT!, I really don't know. The Hige Hige Bandits make an appearance, and there's this one blue character with bushy gray eyebrows and a cape that is seen spying on Golem Bomber. While he does, from a certain point of view, look like a younger Bagular, I can't be sure. He also may be a Jetters character, but I never watched the anime to know it. I have the mugshots, so you can take a look: here.

Now to Pretty Bomber... Truthfully, I found about that last week when I saw the gif in Zaphe's signature. As an avid fanboy, I searched a lot after finding this and this, a set of commercials and a music clip, both featuring Haruka-san. She also guides a promotional video on the Hudson Headquarters, seen here, although that is not the full version. These videos led me to search for info on the Mr. B Bee album, which I found out had only four tracks, two sang, and two karaoke. Then, I found this. Isn't it somewhat similar with her helmetless sprite (seen here, if you don't remember it)? I still prefer to think she was built following the model of a human body, though, hehe.

[EDIT]: I don't think the manual is wrong, though, because in the intro for Super Bomberman 3, Bagular is seen actually fixing them, proving that they are, in fact, cyborgs. I just think she may have been modelled more human than her companions.

Replenishing, indeed.

Yeah, it does look like they are all intending to stop Bagular from interfering in their tournament. Of course that may also be the only thing uniting them all against him.


It's a chase. You know, to retaliate for the bomb...  


Ah, that's Bagulo. Unfortunately, aside from his name I have no idea what is up with the little guy. I know he is in Panic Bomber PCE and... maybe Fantasy Race?
Anyway, I take it then there's no secret Bagular final boss fight or anything like that, ok (that makes my life easier *lol*)


Wow, a music clip out of the Super Bomberman 2 battle music! That's awesome  
I'm really persuaded they were homaging this actress/singer with SBMan3 password screen now, whether Pretty actually looks like that under her helmet or not.


That is incorrect. Bagular fixing up the five of them like that only proves they are at least partially mechanical, but they could be entirely so just as well.
Bomberman himself has to be at least in part mechanical, we've had ample proof of this in the past (and in the very same Super Bomberman 2, in which his "head monitor" shuts off when an enemy kills him). However, for Bomberman too it seems necessary that he is at least in part organical to perform actions such as eating or reproducing (there are, apparently, families of Bombermen). This would negate the whole point of differentiating the five dastardly bombers by labeling them as cybernetic beings.
UNLESS, by saying this Hudson meant that they were human (or human like) beings turned into Bombermen. Which would explain why Honey can appear human under her helmet and why Brain Bomber and Fire Bomber look so distinctly "patched up" (with the peculiar visors and limbs).

_________________
Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

Actually Bagular got his body restored in Bomberman Hero, but it was destroyed again once he self-destructed his ship after the final fight with Shirobom.

Bagular was revived in Bomberman Hero yes, we were trying to figure when he got killed (or at least the last time he was *lol*)

His body is destroyed in Super Bomberman 3, so that in 4 he is a brain in a pod. Then came Neo Bomberman in which Bagular appeared to be alive and well (even though he seems to be a brain again during the last boss fight... or at least I think he is).
After that is Bomberman World, and once again he has his body, then finally Hero. So I assume it was after World that he wind up dead and had to be resurrected.

_________________
Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

Well that is one persistent fellow.

I kinda don't remember the Neo Bomberman boss fight past the seven cyborgs he send to kill you (because that is the coolest part), but I'll play though it again to check. Also, it was in the first Super Bomberman that Shirobon's head monitor shuts off; in two, his eyes merely get bigger and smaller and something falls out of what I believe is his nose (I know what it is, I just don't know the english name for it). I think Bomberman was originally an android, but as the series progressed Hudson scrapped the idea (he did turn human by the end of the very first Bomberman, though), either fully or partially. I'm also not convinced that is a chase, it seems kinda... calm, you know? Also, I like the idea that the Five Dastardly Bombers were originally human, much like in DBZ. It seems a little cruel to toss them into a scrapyard, lol! In regards to Bagular being or not a secret final boss, I can't reassure that since I've never finished the game. Now I''ll go to school, ciao!

You're right, it was SBMan1... well close enough, they even have the same sprite style  


Well, we still see that happen from his point of view in Bomberman 64 Second Attack (when he is knocked unconscious in the intro as his ship gets sucked into a black hole we see his visual go to static and finally switch off).
And naturally that first Bomberman from the original game was in the "slave robots" early continuity, together with Bomberking, Bomberboy and possibly a few others; before the PCE games came out and introduced the concept of a planet full of happy Bomermen.


They just got bombed. Wouldn't you want to get back at the wrongdoer? They even have their arms outstretched to grab her.


Glad to hear you say that. After all, that is also the background Max is given in Tournament, a game featuring the 5 baddies (directly in relation to that transformation too).


Ah, curses! *lol*

_________________
Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

I vote for the "friendly bomb" theory! Fine, just kidding, you are right. It's just that it seemed kinda sluggish to be a chase, you know? On the other hand, I like the idea that she is on her own side, it suits her best.

In regards to Planet Bomber: well, that is a delicate matter. It should be noted that the first two Super Bombermen were set on Earth instead of Planet Bomber. I'm not exactly sure about Super Bomberman 4, but since it depicts historical time eras (like Classic Japan and the Stone Age), I can guess it is also set on Earth. It was on Super Bomberman 5 that the Planet Bomber was instroduced into the SNES series. The third game, also, can be considered neutral since it shows other planets and a space station, but not the Bombers' homeland itself. As far as I know, the PC Engine series also do not depict Planet Bomber, instead showing Earth in all games except '93 (which takes place on disrupted stars of a foreign galaxy). In fact, I can only remember seeing Planet Bomber on the PSX series, the N64 series, the aforementioned Super Bomberman 5 and, of course, Saturn Bomberman, but not much in the classic series. However, my memory may be failing, so please forgive me if I am wrong.

About Bomberman Tournament... Yeah, I like it, since it brings back the old, not-oval-head-and-not-ugly Pretty Bomber I love so much, but... Is it just me, or Max is plain useless (in most games he appear, too)? Really, gee.

[EDIT]: I will change the name of this topic to "Bomberman discussion", if you don't mind.

I don't think so. I very much doubt Peaceful Earth to actually be Earth. I mean, Super Bomberman is a sequel to the PCE games Bomberman and Bomberman 93 (in SBMan Shirobom allies with his former rival from those games) and in 93 they live on a planet with a purple moon... like the one of Planet Bomber. Odds are Peaceful Land (I saw it translated as either of those, if I'm not mistaken) is a continent on Planet Bomber.


Planet Bomber had its own middle age (check out Pocket Bomberman and Bomberman Wars) so it could have had those periods as well. But it's of little importance since it's time travel anyway.


Yes, as far as I know that was the first game in which we saw "the face" of Planet Bomber.


You should check again the ending of that one (sure there's also a smaller brown moon... but if anything that indicates it's no Earth  )


Unfortunately it's not just you  

_________________
Metroid: Other M - As in "There's the good Metroid games... we chose to do one of some Other Make altogether."

When I said Earth, I didn't mean the actual planet, but the game's representation of it (since there are normal buildings and it does not look as futuristic and... "alien-like" as in '93), sorry, sorry! Super Bomberman is set on Diamond City (and the manual states that Bomberman's homeland is Peace Town, part of this so-called modern metropolis). Super Bomberman 2 seems to be set in the same place, since the same kind of buildings are used and the planet seen in the intro does not have a face or moon (at least not a visible one, as proven here and here again). Also, in the ending for the first game, a white crescent moon is shown. In Bomberman '94, a normal (albeit cartoonized) moon is shown in the ending, alongside normal buildings (although this last part proves nothing, since Super Bomberman 5 shows the bombers playing soccer). Thus, I believe Planet Bomber was a later concept, or maybe something they used once in '93 and decided to bring back in Super Bomberman 5. Personally, I prefer "Earth", since a planet with a bomber face seems kinda cheesy, but that's just me!

About the historical eras: hm, you're right, I had forgotten about Bomberman Wars. However, I just remembered two things: firstly, Super Bomberman 3 is indeed set on Earth, as proven by the Battle Mode with real life countries, which are consistent with the Story Mode's ending. Then, there's Super Bomberman 4's ending, which shows "Earth", not Planet Bomber, as seen here (good grief, I dunno how could I have forgotten about VGMuseum's amazing database). Again to clarify, I don't believe it is our real Earth, it is merely a comparison since Planet Bomber stands for the one with the giant face on it.

The GBC series also seem to be more based on reality than the other games, since it depicts (maybe for the first time, I'm not sure) Bomber the Kid, an Indiana Jones of sorts, and Hero Bomberman, a knight. On a side note, I just finished Bomberman GB and noticed Pretty Bomber appears in the end! I can't believe I didn't notice it before, geez.

Holy crap, I've missed a lot! Here's my input, if it still matters...  

About the planet: Hudson Soft doesn't seem to care much about canonicity. I'm sorry, but it's true. It's as likely that they are different planets as it is that they are all the same. In my opinion, this matter is whatever you, as the audience, want to picutre it, since Hudson Soft doesn't seem to care....

About Bomberman: Same as above, basically. Most of what you hear about this comes from the fans.

About the Five Bad Bombers: They are cyborgs. I don't know why everyone talks about them having "robotic parts" except Pretty Bomber.... the only ones with robotic parts showing are Golem Bomber and Brain Bomber. The left side of Brain Bomber's face seems to have been replaced, and Golem Bomber seems almost entirely robotic. Plasma Bomber and Magnet Bomber show no signs of robotic parts, they have darkened or tinted visors that only show their eyes....
As to what race they are, Pretty Bomber and Magnet Bomber are distinctly human, as you can see their skin (although Magnet Bomber gets sleeves later), the rest are probably human as well since Hudson Soft doesn't delve much into storyline. One of you mentioned they could be humans turned into Bombermen by Bagular. I am positive that Bagular has given them the ability to create bombs, which would probably involve cybernetics. As to what exactly happened to Brain Bomber and Golem Bomber, that most definately doesn't matter, such as the question of why Dr. MechaDoc is the way he is, and why Bazooka Bomber is so heavily patched. They were just designed this way by the developers so that they would look more evil and/or formidable, no apparant history to these injuries (voluntary or involuntary) is or probably ever will be given, since it probably only exists within whatever fanbase has thought about it.

I'm not trying to be a downer, I'm just saying what I know is true about Hudson Soft and expanding on those facts to make my case.

Yeah, I agree. But, trying to make a canonicity out of nothing is what fans do, right?

I do think Hudson tried to make a storyline in the start, but even nowadays the company has over (NIIIIIINE THOOOUSAAAAAAAAND... oh, wrong series) five hundred people, so I suppose there are lots of good and bad ideas, like, for instance, oval-head chibified characters that have no legs, and they end up using many of them, which explains the lack of constant style in the series, thus eliminating any chance of a canon. I sometimes prefer to think they are alternate universes or something, and on my fanfictions I organize them in a consise manner to make something worthy in the end.

Hm, the Five Bomber Kings! I almost forgot about them, the ones that made designing bombers so much easier. I've always wondered why Bazooka Bomber was the way he was, but the most obvious theory is that they are all full androids, since none had human traits (even Lady Bomber had a darkened visor and even though Great Bomber had something that looked like skin in his visor, he looked more like a frog than a person... well, a cool frog at the very least). Oh, I still find these discussions replenishing!

not that it looks like its built into his system, just looks like part of a suite to me, what with the bomber kings and ghost having different shaped heads to bomber-man's more curved tube, they could just be seen as helmets, they can survive in vacuums so it makes sense

I'v always seen all bombermans as bomberppl, part of the discontinuity and lack of a fixed shoreline is that fans can plug and fix as they please, some prefer to think of them as ppl in suites, others as robots but as i kinda like them as an own specie, its nice to assume they cant customize there exterior like all evil bombers have done (exceptions being pirate bomber, pretty bomber to an extent and that lot from SB3 battle mode)

The ethos from super bomberman really was the peak, everyones trait was defined in the name and the character designs were reasonably decent before they started running out of ideas and re-cycling some


hardly  

Hello... infidel!

...

Sorry, couldn't resist the urge. Well, despite having to translate that, and I think I somewhat agree. The SNES series is indeed the best one, and personally I like it more than the N64 series, although those were also very, very good. In the end, that's what we are trying to do in this topic: to make a good storyline. Aaaand I hope we manage to do it, hehe!